[TrisakAminawn]

Yeah, rozzy, that's the idea! Everyone agrees Lidner was cool. Heh. I count only two women Light actually made fall in love with him, plus those three other girlfriends (besides Takada and Misa) he picks up for a couple of days in volume four, plus that girl Yumi he took to Spaceland for cover and manipulated with some cheap words...and he used cheap words on Naomi, too, and they worked, and he immediately switched to thinking of her as an idiot. Which is the problem. I seem to remember that Misa was older, she just acted like a little kid. Actually, wasn't she about twenty when he met her? Yes, I just checked, she was. XD But...yeah, those thoughts sound right, although I was impressed by the line 'oh well, if push comes to shove, I've got the eyes, so I'm stronger' before she'd ever met Kira. And then he was beautiful, as well as her idol and strong, and she decided to fall in love with him. Stupidest idea ever. (And while very useful in the 'keeping Light alive long enough to finish the story and giving him a new tool to play with' side of plotting, not the most brilliant authoring ever, there.) XD Misa definitely qualifies as 'dumb;' however, she is not really stupid, although once the author stops having a use for her she completely stops thinking, and so whether she's stupid doesn't really change anything.

XD Mikami Teru...had nice hair and crazy eyes...and, uh...he was a lawyer. What's...not to be impressed by? (Did I say he was cool? What was I on? Maybe I just meant 'crowd-grabbing,' and/or that he had style. And, look, he was dramatically insane. If you're going to be a goon, it's better to be a dramatically flipped-out goon than a goo-goo sweet-talked goon.)

There were more throwaway male roles, but just because there were more males, including all the random grunts; like, females don't enter the real world except for very serious purposes. But XD Yes, Misura had way more depth of character than Penber. (However, she didn't object to him saying, 'don't worry, soon you'll be so busy keeping house you'll forget you ever had a career of your own.' Jerk. Not bad enough to die, though.) I was sure she was going to come back somehow, too. Couldn't believe she'd really been thrown away. Gyah.
Yeah, her name wasn't really Naomi, it was...oh, let's think of a name that goes well with Naomi...Naphtali? Nariko? Nami? That twist is actually a great idea, except that there's no way she'd have known to go walking away like her mind was absolutely fixed on something right after Kira confessed himself to her. No one thinks fast enough to do that. If she knew he was Kira, and knew he didn't have her real name (yet), even though he thought he did, the smart thing to do would be to KO him right there, though she might not be tough enough. Oh! Inspired by the 'driver's license:' I wonder how much 'photoshopping' and 'airbrushing' you could give a photo before Misa's eyes would not work on it anymore.

By the way, does anyone know whether 'Koki' is an exclusively female name? 'cause if it is, add one more cool woman, even if we never see her face. It's that announcer during Misa's Sakura TV debut. "Let me screw up my courage and say this...[The police] are doing the right thing! This is how a country under the rule of law should respond! My name is Koki Tanakabara, I am Koki Tanakabara on THN's Golden News!"

[Not to get too off-series, but yes, the women in Bleach do pretty well for themselves, and I am vastly amused by the number of times Rukia has rescued Ichigo, but Orihime's character value has been falling off lately, sadly. No manga-ka does women as well as FMA's Arakawa, though.] On PMS: personal experience, yes, but actually not with my own body.

Ah, Black Widows. Yeeeeessss...a vanishingly small fraction of murders, and of murders committed by women, but occasionally one of them will successfully get through several husbands. Women do statistically mostly kill spouses and children, when they kill anyone. Oh--can I say this? Totally not Death Note, but I really want to. There's this chapter in the Sandman volume 'The Doll's House' which is set at America's first mass serial-killer convention. Horrifyingly well attended. (They booked themselves into the hotel as a 'Cereal' convention. It's all quite hush-hush.) Anyway, there's one 'panel discussion' called 'women in serial killing' where this Asian woman known to the media as Dog Soup is saying "I'm tired of women in our line of work being stereotyped as black widows and killer nurses. I'm a woman, and a serial killer, and I'm proud of it!" Damn scary, but a really great/funny line. Anyone else here read it?

Dan Brown? His father wrote my math textbook. End of interest. I don't like his gimmicks, either, (I happen to be fond of John the Evangelist,) but I'm not surprised they're making a movie. They almost never make movies out of really good books, and eighty percent of the time when they do, they ruin them completely. Hahah. Oh--Matt. My dear Gawain's theory on Matt's popularity is this: he and Mello are the only people in the entire second half of the series who betray any sign of genuine affectionate connection between them. Matt risks his life for Mello's whatsit, and Mello is sorry that he dragged Matt into it and got him killed. Probably the only specimen of friendship in the whole story. Or it could just be the goggles and the bike. I dunno.

>> Stopping here. You know, no one on these forums has ever yelled at me for posting too much? Yay.

[WolvenLordSoulReaper]

QUOTE BY TRASAK_AMINAWN: Yeah, her name wasn't really Naomi, it was...oh, let's think of a name that goes well with Naomi...Naphtali? Nariko? Nami? That twist is actually a great idea, except that there's no way she'd have known to go walking away like her mind was absolutely fixed on something right after Kira confessed himself to her. No one thinks fast enough to do that. If she knew he was Kira, and knew he didn't have her real name (yet), even though he thought he did, the smart thing to do would be to KO him right there, though she might not be tough enough. Oh! Inspired by the 'driver's license:' I wonder how much 'photoshopping' and 'airbrushing' you could give a photo before Misa's eyes would not work on it anymore. ENDQUOTE

Tsk, tsk. Somone clearly woke up on the wrong side of the primordial ooze, LOL. My Mikami bashing hit a little close to the nerve there, LOL.

See... in theory what you said here is completely accurate. That's assuming we allow a few flawed facts to counter our reasoning. Namely we must assume that #1: Misa Naomi knew what a Shinigami was, as well as its ability to dispense death. #2: That Shinigami allow the ability to see a user's name just by looking at their face for 1/2 of that person's lifespan in a contract clause we like to call, 'The Shinigami Eye Deal'. #3: Naomi was all-knowing, and knew that Misa would eventually (if she had not already) acquire Shinigami eyes. #4: That Light Yagami, who just revealed himself as Kira, had the eyes of Shinigami, or at least had present someone who did. #5: Most Importantly of all; we must assume that Naomi Misura knew for a fact that Light Yagami was dating Misa Amane who had the Shinigami eyes who Light had not even met yet!! (BTW: I hope I didn't come off too terse there. I was truly amused at your post simply BECAUSE I clearly picked up on the sarcastic undertones. I love sarcasm, and had to duly respond, no offense taken, I hope, it was all in fun.:-)

In regards to MT; I didn't say you said he was cool, I said I couldn't figure out why everyone thought he was so cool. (I have the same stance on Light, as well, in case you couldn't tell:-)

Being an aspiring author and all-around reader, I am aware that Hollywood does nothing for anything it translates to the Big Screen. Rare is the exception and on that note all three X-Men movies sucked, I don't care what the wannabe fans at large had to say on that! (Sadly though, my reading gap is also significant; and Sandman I'm still trying to get around to, as well as N.G. in general.)

I had prior knowledge (someone referred to you in the male perspective somewhere. I'm certain of it); so yeah, I didn't think it was your body, LOL.

[Flash Master]

I think a woman could have been L, (given the intelligence, of course,) although if she wanted to get anything done she would have had to conceal herself rather more carefully, and/or go to rather more trouble to get the task force, et. al., to take her seriously. Because people, like Flash, will believe more of a strange man than a strange women, so a man can get more done in a leadership position with less effort. Bugger, isn't it? POSTED BY T.A

Well, I had expected to be slammed by a women. This is a delightful surprise if I may say.
First off, I was not intending to impune the intelligence or skill of any female out there. I was merely intending to establish the reasons as to WHY a women would be a less likely candidate than a man. It is a scientific and statistical fact that men are more intelligent than women by about 4 I.Q points on average, making them better suited for complex tasks.
Women however have better memories because they experience life events more intensely.
Men are not affected by emotions the same way as women not because they don't feel emotion
but because they approach emotions from a logical perspective either disregarding them or leaving them be until a solution can be found. Not all men of course. THIS IS MY LIMITED OBSERVATION ONLY.
Secondly, I personally do not trust or believe a male or female of whom I am not well acquainted and find anyone who does simply ridiculous. Trust is costly and must be earned, regardless of gender.
In reference to Naomi Misaru, I must agree that Kira, male or female would have killed her even after her story. I myself would have found it silly that her life would have been over without her fiance, might as well put her out of her misery. I must digress on my previous statements and dramatizations on my last post.
I can certainly point out all of the ridiculous little men as well and the inferiorities of man vs. woman if you like but that would be pointless as our views obviously differ. I respect that and I enjoy reading your posts. They are thoughtful and insightful.
Perhaps my post was not as articulate as it should have been. My point is simply this . Physiologically or professionally, a woman must work much harder than a man to achieve
most anything but anything can be equally accomplished by a woman.
For the record, every woman gets pissy on p.m.s. Any woman who doesn't is a medical mystery. Some things even science can't explain. (my opinion only.)
One last question T.A, if you saw someone lurking in a dark alley, would you be as worried if it were a women?? You should be.

[TrisakAminawn]

Haha...sorry, both of you, I think I sounded more aggressive than I meant to be. XD Primordial ooze. Half the Misura paragraph was just rambling. Especially the part about Misa. (And honestly, I dislike Mikami Teru, Wolven, I swear to you. Really. But he has got a higher charisma count than Misa, give him that.) There're...actually an awful lot of M names in this story, aren't there?

Better suited for complex tasks is harsh, Flash. It sounds like measuring monkeys or slaves on the block or something. Jury's out on whether women's innate mental capacities are actually lesser or whether it's societal training dragging down the average. After all, little girls are usually smarter than little boys, and growing girls are taught to be stupider. Obviously not all of them comply, but there's a lot less pressure for guys to not-think, so there's a statistical advantage there. (Fun data: usually, in schools, if a boy fails at something, the teacher tells him he isn't trying, but if a girl fails, she's told she isn't very good at whatever-it-is.) And men are also known to have more trouble with their tempers than women, statistically, which isn't exactly emotional detachment. It's all pretty hard to quantify. Anything that involves getting the respect of other people is harder for a woman, that's for sure, and we could make the argument than most women are burdened with an inferiority complex that makes psychological accomplishments more difficult, but I still think Flash's words are too harsh. Ah well.

Psych evaluations of women have started to make a lot more sense since the textbooks started allowing for them, though. Forty years ago, half of what girls did was technically abnormal, because all the standards were based on males. Basically, most women were officially insane, which was put down to their being women. So I'm not saying there's no difference. >>;

[WolvenLordSoulReaper]

Originally Posted by TrisakAminawn

Haha...sorry, both of you, I think I sounded more aggressive than I meant to be. XD Primordial ooze. Half the Misura paragraph was just rambling. Especially the part about Misa. (And honestly, I dislike Mikami Teru, Wolven, I swear to you. Really. But he has got a higher charisma count than Misa, give him that.) There're...actually an awful lot of M names in this story, aren't there?

And men are also known to have more trouble with their tempers than women, statistically, which isn't exactly emotional detachment.
>>;

Hey, you talkin' to me, punk?! Are ya'?! Nah, I didn't think so... LOL. Nowwhere on earth could you have possibly come up with such drivel, TA; LOL.

As far as sounding harsh; I considered more of a sporting opportunity:-) I just couldn't resist the temptation of responding so sarcastically on your sarcasm. That was pretty fun, LOL.

Don't worry, I won't ZERO in on you;-)

[Rjina]

Ha... you may not remember me, because I haven't posted anything for such a long time... But I just thought I'd interject (I apologize for my rudeness) to post a word or two.

----

I believe women in essence carry the same mental capacity as men--however, long-held traditions such as the idea of the housewife and the executive woman have made social advancements a surprise, rather than a step forward. I'm sure you all know of the glass ceilings women (and minorities) encounter in the economic world. All in all, women are holding themselves back. I don't care if some deny it, saying "I really feel this way in my heart," because it's true: there will always be a naturally maternal instinct that prohibits women from taking specific measures. There isn't much statistics to this at all. It's just personal hurdles, in my opinion.
...And I actually adore Mikami Teru--though I can see why some people dislike him. His over-zealous and meticulous personality can seem obsessive and disturbing, but he is an incredibly respectable character in his own respects. He has amazing intuition (as far as Kira is concerned), and has a plausible purpose and reason behind everything he does--yes, even the killings that he seems to uncontrollably execute (I think we're all familiar with "Sakujo.").
Despite his tendency to kill with wild intensity, there is still an extreme order. For example, he remains faithful to his rigid schedule, and only fills in a certain portion of the Death Note.
If I can describe his behavior, I'd say he is the taut cord of a bow--tight and intense, but a straight line, nonetheless.
He also acted not upon selfish impulses (besides the pride in being the hand of his 'god'), but in a sincere wish to enact Kira's will, for Kira's sake. This seemingly absurd loyalty is not unusual. History is filled with figures like Mikami Teru, most of whom--like our unfortunate man of the law--end up as figurative martyrs for their beliefs.
...Sometimes I think I truly know for a fact that Mikami is the mangaka's bitter metaphorical depiction of mankind's relationship with their gods.
Of all of the characters (I include L, Light, Misa, Light's father, Misora, Penbar), I think the path Mikami treads once his road crosses Kira's is by far one of the most painful. I don't need to explain.
On top of that, Mikami ends his own life by the use of a pen. Though it seems far-fetched and--for the more cynical--a bit humorous, his death is actually quite symbolic. Though Light himself had killed the criminals, and others who stood in his way, he could not have done so without the use of his writing tool--which was his pen (which I think represents 'purpose').
...Sorry for the pun, but Mikami took his 'purpose' straight to heart.

[dia_de_luz]

Not really. They made the story more interesting but they were to weak and easily manipulated.

[Flash Master]

I am a little mixed on M.T . I do feel that his belief was that he was making the world better and yet I cannot see how anyone could be manipulated so easily. Yet I suppose however pathetic it seems to me, people are very different. Some people are terribly insecure and are desiring so badly for guidance and notice that they are easily ensnared. He made the eye deal a little too quickly which I
find silly but I digress. . He is a tragic character because of his circumstances yet he was unable to find strength in himself. I suppose individual strength is the key. Hey, does that mean gender has nothing to do with ??? NOOOO!! That means I might be wrong! Oops, did I say that out loud?
Oh well. T.A-1 Flash Master-0
I will win the next one!!!!
Does it seem like Mikami was not emphasized enough? I mean wouldn't you like to know even more about him? He's kind of weak to me but I am always curios about such people. I think the same about Mello though and MIsa had waaay too much screen time.

P.S - I remember you Rjina and I am newer to the bunch. WELCOME BACK!

[TrisakAminawn]

Yeah, Mikami was underdeveloped. He had the misfortune of being introduced during the long, long 'downslide' segment of the manga, when nothing positive was allowed to happen and everything was increasingly grim and flat, so on the one hand he stood out as someone who actually existed and had, as I've said, magnetism, style, and good looks, but on the other hand he was swept up in the hopelessness of the concluding segments. That said, he was simple and annoying. At least Light didn't develop a conscious savior complex with attendant delusions until he acquired genuine supernatural powers.

...it's funny, Rjina, you put the difference down to traditional roles, rather than essence, but then you say that there is a barrier of instinct that will perpetually prevent women from taking specific measures. I can't work out your opinion. And...I don't know quite how to read 'specific measures.' Do you mean there are some particular things that women can't do because they're hard-wired to be mothers?

[Flash Master]

Although I partially agree with Rjina, I think the world actually encourages the woman to be the lesser sex. Look at the military. Supposedly, men and women have to train the same yet a
woman's boot camp requires less physical activity than men and they actually get paid more for
" personal items". That is simply ridiculous. Last time I checked, equal meant balance. This does not appear to be the case. Mind you this was the standards I read in my ANG handbook about four years ago so things might have changed since then.
Nevertheless, a woman needs to prove herself as an equal instead of trying to alter the "standards" so that she can fit into a mans world.
I have seen some female MMA fighters who could probably mop the floor with some of those ultimate fighter boys. A woman is always defeated mentally before physically, but I do believe
that maternal instinct does hinder their ability to be more cut throat whether in business or
physical achievements. However, I completely disagree with those woman who get all mad because a man opens a door for her. I open doors for guys too. It's called " being polite".
Many woman get upset because a man does not treat her right and yet they snuff a chivalrous act of kindness because it is " chauvinistic Just because a woman is strong in all aspects of her life, does not mean she should be anything less than a lady. Same goes for the guys. Be a gentleman already. It's not really about gender. It's about inner strength and respect. Let's all just play nice, right?
Sorry, rambling.