[WolvenLordSoulReaper]

I am utterly amazed at the amount of people who are so enthralled by Light Yagami and the false sense of brilliance/empowerment people attributed to his actions. Many times, his sheer arrogance and the idiotic delusion of being 'unstoppable' nearly brought his 'God High' to a crushing low.

Here's just a few of the ignorant blunders Light made which could have cost him just a little bit more than his Godhood:

#1: He was just way too eager to believe that Lind L. Taylor was L, resulting in a very grievous tip of the hand that supplied L with more than he could have hoped for. This alone would loose Yagami some sleep for the days to come.

#2: Getting into Souichiro's crime files... a Federal Offense; Light would have been hard pressed to explain that, as even with the 'I'm going to be a detective' story, the legality of the crime still holds precedence. (And yes, I know Light lives in Japan, but if the F.B.I. believed Federal security to be compromised, even without the Kira murders going on, they would've sent investigators nonetheless.)

#3: Had any one camera been located in light's room adequately, the potato chip fiasco could've gone real sour real fast.

#4: Working on the taskforce while not 'possessed'. This would arise a very interesting situation I commented on in another thread that, save for a little blind luck, would have nailed Light in the rear royally; this was way out of his control, and he can't be faulted in any way, shape or form for not realizing this could happen, because there was simply no way on earth he could predict it without being God; but it again shows just how lucky Light really was, as opposed to actually being skilled... After writing the fake 13 day rule, Light could never have foreseen him, as L, demanding that Yotsuba cease killing with the NoteBook for a full two weeks. No matter how well Light decides he really 'knows what he would do', (displaying his unprecedented levels of arrogance as well), he can't ever have predicted he would have said that. It's impossible.

#5: Underestimating Mellow wasn't too bright either.

#6: This is Light's hugest God Saving stroke of luck ever... Had this had gone wrong, Light's reign would have been drastically shortened indeed.

Daddy having Shinigami eyes. Did you notice Light's confused look when Souichiro said he was glad Light wasn't Kira? Light told Misa he wanted her to judge others thinking that no one could trail the Book back to his actions, but he certainly failed to even remotely consider that someone on the inside might have used the Shinigami eyes to determine if Light really was Kira or not. This could have been very messy indeed. i could only imagine the t.f.'s reactions if Souichiro said Yagami was, indeed, Kira.

Light's idiotic reaction to his dad's death didn't help matters either. Especially with Aizawa, who had to have really been wondering about Yagami's son begging his dying father to remove one of Kira's then biggest obstacles. "C'mon, you idiot! Just write his name?!'

Was Kira really God? Perhaps. At least if you're an Acolyte of Loki's...

[Flash Master]

You are right Reaper. Wish my powers of deduction were like that. Hey though, in reference to the bus incident, don't forget that usually, individuals in a hostage situation are questioned by law enforcement and their statements taken as evidence. Ray Pember , Light and his lovely little girlfriend should have all been detained for questioning. Awkward. Not only daddy Yagami but L would have caught wind of that really quick. Also, Light's date was in highschool which no offense to any teenyboppers out there but that in itself is the most efficient albeit inaccurate news agency of all time. She would have been spewing her near death experience, Lights heroic actions, the scared little man in the back seat and secured book and movie rights before third period. Way to be cool, Light.

[Rjina]

Interesting, Reaper. it seems that most of these "deficiencies" stem from his utter and inexcusable pride/vanity.

However, I can't anything against his vanity, nor can I criticize his character. I'm sure that if I were gifted with his obvious (meaning, there is absolutely no mistake of it) intelligence, I might have felt the same.

In some ways, I admire his fiery disposition. Though his mistakes are not god-worthy, no one can be perfect. It only makes the "tragedy" (if I may call it so) of his death more powerful. There is a lesson to be learned here, no? Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

[ZERO PHOENIX]

Well SoulReaper, I find your post to be utterly offensive! AHAHAAH I'm kidding, I'm kidding. To be honest I really enjoyed it as I was looking for a thread of interest. Hmmm, I would (predictably) however have to disagree. I think that some of these examples reinforce just how great Light was and how he, in some instances had a much worthier cause that some of the other characters (like you L!). Might we examine some of your arguments?

"I am utterly amazed at the amount of people who are so enthralled by Light Yagami and the false sense of brilliance/empowerment people attributed to his actions. Many times, his sheer arrogance and the idiotic delusion of being 'unstoppable' nearly brought his 'God High' to a crushing low."

"Here's just a few of the ignorant blunders Light made which could have cost him just a little bit more than his Godhood:"

#1: He was just way too eager to believe that Lind L. Taylor was L, resulting in a very grievous tip of the hand that supplied L with more than he could have hoped for. This alone would loose Yagami some sleep for the days to come.

Well that is true. I have no defense against that. I personally would never have taken that bait, and Light fell for it hook line and sinker.

#2: Getting into Souichiro's crime files... a Federal Offense; Light would have been hard pressed to explain that, as even with the 'I'm going to be a detective' story, the legality of the crime still holds precedence. (And yes, I know Light lives in Japan, but if the F.B.I. believed Federal security to be compromised, even without the Kira murders going on, they would've sent investigators nonetheless.)

That is if Light got caught. For starters, if Light is going to be god of the new world, the rules of Man do not apply to him. A Federal Offense? Man cannot judge a god. Also, the fact that Light was not caught just reinforces the magnitude of his intelligence. If anyone takes offense please forgive me but we are talking about a kid. A mere 17 year old kid who was able to hack into some highly classified documents and get the information he needs. And he didn't get caught because he actions were too well thought out. Truly a level of intelligence worth applauding.

#3: Had any one camera been located in light's room adequately, the potato chip fiasco could've gone real sour real fast.

The same thing here. IF the cameras or even one camera was more adequately placed Light would have been in trouble. But think about Light's innovation. Potato chips?! My word! And he also knew the angle, range, and trajectory of all the cameras in his room. He was able to outsmart L and ruin his little ploy. For Light to have assessed the situation in such a short amount of time and utilize most unconventional means, (potato chips, man) to thwart L and continue his objectives clearly shows a very high level of critical thinking skills.

#4: Working on the taskforce while not 'possessed'. This would arise a very interesting situation I commented on in another thread that, save for a little blind luck, would have nailed Light in the rear royally; this was way out of his control, and he can't be faulted in any way, shape or form for not realizing this could happen, because there was simply no way on earth he could predict it without being God; but it again shows just how lucky Light really was, as opposed to actually being skilled... After writing the fake 13 day rule, Light could never have foreseen him, as L, demanding that Yotsuba cease killing with the NoteBook for a full two weeks. No matter how well Light decides he really 'knows what he would do', (displaying his unprecedented levels of arrogance as well), he can't ever have predicted he would have said that. It's impossible.

I have to disagree and please correct me if I misunderstood something. I want to argue correctly. Now, I have to disagree. Light foresaw all of these things well in advance. His actions, L's actions, and the events that would follow. I'm not talking about any phoney tarot cards, palm reading, astrology, or some other played out form of occult delusions either. We are talking about a guy who used psychology, and logic, science my friends to predict the moves of his enemies, his own, and future events. For him to have seen the future as clearly and as easily as he did, could he not have the mind of a god? And this could never have come back to bite Light on the rear. He foresaw everything! Furthermore, Light would never have gone through with his plans which led to those events were victory not certain. Light planned for everything and thus victory was 100 percent assured to him. Were it not, he would never have gone through with his plan.

#5: Underestimating Mellow wasn't too bright either.

I totally agree. That was a bad move. Mellow impressed the heck out of me.

#6: This is Light's hugest God Saving stroke of luck ever... Had this had gone wrong, Light's reign would have been drastically shortened indeed.

Daddy having Shinigami eyes. Did you notice Light's confused look when Souichiro said he was glad Light wasn't Kira? Light told Misa he wanted her to judge others thinking that no one could trail the Book back to his actions, but he certainly failed to even remotely consider that someone on the inside might have used the Shinigami eyes to determine if Light really was Kira or not. This could have been very messy indeed. i could only imagine the t.f.'s reactions if Souichiro said Yagami was, indeed, Kira.

Light's idiotic reaction to his dad's death didn't help matters either. Especially with Aizawa, who had to have really been wondering about Yagami's son begging his dying father to remove one of Kira's then biggest obstacles. "C'mon, you idiot! Just write his name?!'
I have to disagree and I must admit that I am not certain if this particular argument is dealing with the manga or the anime. I've seen that particular episode but I haven't read up to that chapter. Let me know if I mess up. Hmmm, I don't think Light's father would ever have found out that Light was Kira. You see, in the anime, Light knew about the ideal the entire time and even before it went down, he relinquinshed ownership of the DEATH NOTE so that his father would be able to see his lifespan. I haven't read the chapter yet but in the anime at least, Light would never have been discovered via the eyes. I don't think luck has much, if not anything to do with Light's success. He has proven time and time again that his own intelligence is far greater than luck. Light doesn't need luck, he has logic!

Was Kira really God? Perhaps. At least if you're an Acolyte of Loki's...
I honestly don't think anyone believes Light was God. Boy I hope not. When I say god as in the lowercase "g" I am simply putting characters like Light and Pain in the same range as the Norse gods, Greek gods, Hindu gods, etcetera. I really hope no one thinks that Light was actually captial "G". Of course I am just clarifying. Boy you have a totally good argument. I gotta contact screaming_midget!

[Talus]

Amazing as always, Zero Phoenix.

[WolvenLordSoulReaper]

QUOTE BY ZERO_PHOENIX: I have to disagree and please correct me if I misunderstood something. I want to argue correctly. Now, I have to disagree. Light foresaw all of these things well in advance. His actions, L's actions, and the events that would follow. I'm not talking about any phoney tarot cards, palm reading, astrology, or some other played out form of occult delusions either. We are talking about a guy who used psychology, and logic, science my friends to predict the moves of his enemies, his own, and future events. For him to have seen the future as clearly and as easily as he did, could he not have the mind of a god? And this could never have come back to bite Light on the rear. He foresaw everything! Furthermore, Light would never have gone through with his plans which led to those events were victory not certain. Light planned for everything and thus victory was 100 percent assured to him. Were it not, he would never have gone through with his plan.QUOTE

The thing I'm saying here is that it was impossible for Light to predict who Rem gave the NoteBook to after he 'relinquished' it, and he certainly couldn't have known it would go to Yotsuba, or that he working with L would demand Yotsuba stop killing for a full two weeks, especially after he put a fake rule in the book about killing within 13 days or dying. To see all of that, in that precise amount of detail... yeah, he would have had to been God.

On the whole Souichiro deal, I gotta recheck on that in the manga, where I thought I read it, but sometimes I get things mixed up, so we'll see:-) BTW: I cow and whimper and your altar of greatness, you have some very strongly pointed yet poetically resonating posts. Very Nice:-)

[screaming_midget]

Originally Posted by ZERO PHOENIX

Well SoulReaper, I find your post to be utterly offensive! AHAHAAH I'm kidding, I'm kidding. To be honest I really enjoyed it as I was looking for a thread of interest. Hmmm, I would (predictably) however have to disagree. I think that some of these examples reinforce just how great Light was and how he, in some instances had a much worthier cause that some of the other characters (like you L!). Might we examine some of your arguments?

"I am utterly amazed at the amount of people who are so enthralled by Light Yagami and the false sense of brilliance/empowerment people attributed to his actions. Many times, his sheer arrogance and the idiotic delusion of being 'unstoppable' nearly brought his 'God High' to a crushing low."

"Here's just a few of the ignorant blunders Light made which could have cost him just a little bit more than his Godhood:"

#1: He was just way too eager to believe that Lind L. Taylor was L, resulting in a very grievous tip of the hand that supplied L with more than he could have hoped for. This alone would loose Yagami some sleep for the days to come.

Well that is true. I have no defense against that. I personally would never have taken that bait, and Light fell for it hook line and sinker.

#2: Getting into Souichiro's crime files... a Federal Offense; Light would have been hard pressed to explain that, as even with the 'I'm going to be a detective' story, the legality of the crime still holds precedence. (And yes, I know Light lives in Japan, but if the F.B.I. believed Federal security to be compromised, even without the Kira murders going on, they would've sent investigators nonetheless.)

That is if Light got caught. For starters, if Light is going to be god of the new world, the rules of Man do not apply to him. A Federal Offense? Man cannot judge a god. Also, the fact that Light was not caught just reinforces the magnitude of his intelligence. If anyone takes offense please forgive me but we are talking about a kid. A mere 17 year old kid who was able to hack into some highly classified documents and get the information he needs. And he didn't get caught because he actions were too well thought out. Truly a level of intelligence worth applauding.

#3: Had any one camera been located in light's room adequately, the potato chip fiasco could've gone real sour real fast.

The same thing here. IF the cameras or even one camera was more adequately placed Light would have been in trouble. But think about Light's innovation. Potato chips?! My word! And he also knew the angle, range, and trajectory of all the cameras in his room. He was able to outsmart L and ruin his little ploy. For Light to have assessed the situation in such a short amount of time and utilize most unconventional means, (potato chips, man) to thwart L and continue his objectives clearly shows a very high level of critical thinking skills.

#4: Working on the taskforce while not 'possessed'. This would arise a very interesting situation I commented on in another thread that, save for a little blind luck, would have nailed Light in the rear royally; this was way out of his control, and he can't be faulted in any way, shape or form for not realizing this could happen, because there was simply no way on earth he could predict it without being God; but it again shows just how lucky Light really was, as opposed to actually being skilled... After writing the fake 13 day rule, Light could never have foreseen him, as L, demanding that Yotsuba cease killing with the NoteBook for a full two weeks. No matter how well Light decides he really 'knows what he would do', (displaying his unprecedented levels of arrogance as well), he can't ever have predicted he would have said that. It's impossible.

I have to disagree and please correct me if I misunderstood something. I want to argue correctly. Now, I have to disagree. Light foresaw all of these things well in advance. His actions, L's actions, and the events that would follow. I'm not talking about any phoney tarot cards, palm reading, astrology, or some other played out form of occult delusions either. We are talking about a guy who used psychology, and logic, science my friends to predict the moves of his enemies, his own, and future events. For him to have seen the future as clearly and as easily as he did, could he not have the mind of a god? And this could never have come back to bite Light on the rear. He foresaw everything! Furthermore, Light would never have gone through with his plans which led to those events were victory not certain. Light planned for everything and thus victory was 100 percent assured to him. Were it not, he would never have gone through with his plan.

#5: Underestimating Mellow wasn't too bright either.

I totally agree. That was a bad move. Mellow impressed the heck out of me.

#6: This is Light's hugest God Saving stroke of luck ever... Had this had gone wrong, Light's reign would have been drastically shortened indeed.

Daddy having Shinigami eyes. Did you notice Light's confused look when Souichiro said he was glad Light wasn't Kira? Light told Misa he wanted her to judge others thinking that no one could trail the Book back to his actions, but he certainly failed to even remotely consider that someone on the inside might have used the Shinigami eyes to determine if Light really was Kira or not. This could have been very messy indeed. i could only imagine the t.f.'s reactions if Souichiro said Yagami was, indeed, Kira.

Light's idiotic reaction to his dad's death didn't help matters either. Especially with Aizawa, who had to have really been wondering about Yagami's son begging his dying father to remove one of Kira's then biggest obstacles. "C'mon, you idiot! Just write his name?!'
I have to disagree and I must admit that I am not certain if this particular argument is dealing with the manga or the anime. I've seen that particular episode but I haven't read up to that chapter. Let me know if I mess up. Hmmm, I don't think Light's father would ever have found out that Light was Kira. You see, in the anime, Light knew about the ideal the entire time and even before it went down, he relinquinshed ownership of the DEATH NOTE so that his father would be able to see his lifespan. I haven't read the chapter yet but in the anime at least, Light would never have been discovered via the eyes. I don't think luck has much, if not anything to do with Light's success. He has proven time and time again that his own intelligence is far greater than luck. Light doesn't need luck, he has logic!

Was Kira really God? Perhaps. At least if you're an Acolyte of Loki's...
I honestly don't think anyone believes Light was God. Boy I hope not. When I say god as in the lowercase "g" I am simply putting characters like Light and Pain in the same range as the Norse gods, Greek gods, Hindu gods, etcetera. I really hope no one thinks that Light was actually captial "G". Of course I am just clarifying. Boy you have a totally good argument. I gotta contact screaming_midget!

my dear friend zero i hate to say this but i have to totally disagree with ur counter arguments.

counter arguement two you say hes a god and laws of man dont apply to him bc he was a god. he was neither an actuall god nor had he achieved his true god hood in the eyes of other because it wasnt to long before hand that he was just an urban myth and he only had a scattered amount of followers, also bc he thought to clean up the computer does not cannote brillaince. thats common sense. if i do something wrong and dont want to get caught id hide evidence to the best of my abilities. sure he was smart for hiding it so well, but do we really do he covered his tracks perfectly. whose to say that a team of lab rats couldnt have found everything. he just got lucky no one checked.

also counter argument 4 light did NOT PREDICT everything. his plan lest so much to chance it wasnt funny and was so much based of luck. for example what if rem gave it to a selfish person who was as smart as l and light, hm wouldnt have been so easy to get the note then. also l was still predicting him as much light foresaw his actions. also he didnt count on misa forgestting ls name or the fact that when light got his memories back and killed kira 3 that l could have looked over and saw what he was doing and WAHLAH PLAN SHOT TO HELL. not only that ik that he needed to get the death note back in his possesion so he could keep his memories, but hm the second u have a notebook that kills in ur hand the previous owner dies, wow THATS A RED FLAG IF EVER I SAW IT! also he didnt count on one thing that could have screwed him out of l dying. REM BETRAYING HIM! she could have wrote in her deathnote and made him confess and also say he framed misa or she could have told rem everything.

and your last argument that luck has little to nothing to do with his success. i think its half the reason he succeeded. one penbers finacee. if he hadnt been lucky enough to be giving his dad clothes she would have eventually got in touch with the taskforce and his plans would have been foiled. he was also lucky that the people at the front desk never told his father she was there with light. if they did he would have been screwed. also he was lucky that the task force member who was on his way to the office didnt see them together. if he did they could have beed screwed. also the bus accident could have blown up in his face as mentioned earlier for the same reason. luck saved his ass again. also his whole status as kira is determined by him being lucky enough to find the notebook in the first place. also if he didnt have the fortune of finding another kira in misa none of the events that followed and led to ls death would have happened.

[TrisakAminawn]

Yah...midget's right, especially about Naomi Misura. Light was so lucky so often. Rem was one of the things that mostly didn't depend on luck, because he had her figured: she was willing to die to make Misa happy. Of course, if he had got her wrong, she could have done anything in the world to him before killing him, but he didn't; he had her figured right. He certainly was amazing. I was particularly impressed at the way he held in his tantrum until he was alone in his room, although he must really count on those walls to be soundproof. Can you imagine if Sachiko had been in the hall and heard her son scream like that...and then laugh like that...and then say a thing like "I'll make you trust me. And when you've told me everything I need to know, I'll kill you." What would she do? She'd...tell her husband, wouldn't she?

Here's a good idiocy for you: Ryuk told him all along that eventually he'd kill him. Yet Light was surprised?

And of course his usual idiocy, the one that finally destroyed him: needing to gloat and see his victim's eyes when they knew who had defeated them. A self-destructive tendency in a secret murderer if I ever saw one. He was okay with Pember, because no one happened to be paying close enough attention to the dying man to spot Light smirking and hear Pember say his name; he made it with Misura because he turned out to really be able to completely control her thoughts, though he'd never tested how complete that was; he didn't get caught with L because he calculated the position of his triumphant expression so that only L could see it and L was really beyond speaking by then; but he wasn't as safe as he thought he was at the end, and it was the end of him. 'I win.' If he didn't have this need to have other people acknowledge that he's beaten them...

[ZERO PHOENIX]

"If he didn't have this need to have other people acknowledge that he's beaten them..."

Yes I do agree with Trisak in this respect. Had Light not needed to gloat over each and every single victory, then perhaps his end would not have come as it did. My word achieve, succeed, then gloat. There will be time for dancing when you are surrounded by the bodies of your enemies.