[LynFay]

I DON'T GET IT!!! aren't the Hunter's society AGAINST vampires? why is the lady with the fan talking civily to Ichjiu's Grandpa? She seems to be working underneath him... is she going over to the dark side???!
P.s- How did zero deserve to be thrown in jail?? he's not really a massive threat...

[wolveshowl]

I KNOW! I really wonder.... maybe she has some grudge?...... Revenge?....... AH!! SOMEONE SMARTER THAN ME, PLEASE HELP US NOW!!

[Kira Nightroad]

I've always had a hunch that the hunter's organization was rigged. It really does not surprise me that the are working together since the hunters have to get their list from someone*cough*council*cough*

As for Ichiru's brother; I do not enjoy him very much, but I can tolerate him to some extent and I agree that putting him in a cage was a bit much. However, if you think about it, the Kiryu family was like the fall guys and blaming zero and Ichiru for a lot of things that has happened sure makes it easier for the organization doesn't it?

I'm assuming the chairman knows this too and it could be the reason he doesn't work directly with them

[seeliespright]

Both groups seem to be about control, and are motivated by the desire to dominate in some way. The vampire Senate wants to manipulate the purebloods for their interests and control all of the aristocratic vampires. The hunters' Society wants to control 'renegade' vampires who have lost control. But, as we have seen with Zero, hunters *cough* Toga *cough* are quite willing to kill vampires perfunctorily, even if the vampires have a chance of being managed.

They seem to have thrown Zero into prison because he's become a liability. He knows entirely too much about Yuuki and Kaname and the present troubles, so they've put him somewhere out of the way. Zero made an ambiguous comment about the blood inside of him, which could have possibly been alluding to his loss of control or alternatively to his strong control of himself now that he has both Yuuki and Kaname's blood inside of him. So, I can say if the hunters put Zero into jail with justification, but whether or not it was warranted, they didn't do it for his best interest - they did it for their purposes.

I like the idea Kira proposed about the vampire Senate providing the list of 'renegade vampires' to the hunters' Society. I think that's entirely possible, and that the killings of vampires that the Senate wishes to dispatch are an undercurrent in the activity of the hunters' Society.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean in your second paragraph Kira: Ichiru's "other brother" would be Zero...

As for the Chairman, I'm sure he knows all about the politics of both the vampire Senate and the hunters' Society and knows their machinations intimately. I don't think he'd know about the cooperation between the two, but he _is_ very shrewd so he might...

[Kira Nightroad]

Originally Posted by seeliespright

Both groups seem to be about control, and are motivated by the desire to dominate in some way. The vampire Senate wants to manipulate the purebloods for their interests and control all of the aristocratic vampires. The hunters' Society wants to control 'renegade' vampires who have lost control. But, as we have seen with Zero, hunters *cough* Toga *cough* are quite willing to kill vampires perfunctorily, even if the vampires have a chance of being managed.

They seem to have thrown Zero into prison because he's become a liability. He knows entirely too much about Yuuki and Kaname and the present troubles, so they've put him somewhere out of the way. Zero made an ambiguous comment about the blood inside of him, which could have possibly been alluding to his loss of control or alternatively to his strong control of himself now that he has both Yuuki and Kaname's blood inside of him. So, I can say if the hunters put Zero into jail with justification, but whether or not it was warranted, they didn't do it for his best interest - they did it for their purposes.

I like the idea Kira proposed about the vampire Senate providing the list of 'renegade vampires' to the hunters' Society. I think that's entirely possible, and that the killings of vampires that the Senate wishes to dispatch are an undercurrent in the activity of the hunters' Society

So I'm not the only person who thinks like this; great elaboration :]

Originally Posted by seeliespright

I'm not sure exactly what you mean in your second paragraph Kira: Ichiru's "other brother" would be Zero...

Don't mind me there; I do mean Zero, but I'm just being childish

[LynFay]

Yeah, that all fits, but why would both the Vampire Council and The hunters tolerate each other? like, why not just wipe one group out? that would be the only way to have complete power, and *totally unrelated* do you think that little kid with different coloured eyes is related to Rido? *AND* why is Kaname not caring about whether he lives or dies? don't he love Yuki? shouldn't he realise that if he dies, Yuki would be sad? i mean, he realised that if Zero died Yuki would be sad...

[Individual11]

Are we sure the guy locked up right now is Zero? ---or could it be his twin brother? Nah - it's probably Zero...

I thought that Chapter 38 was interesting because it illustrated how indestructible purebloods really are. Kaname is actually the Kuran "ancestor" who was awakened by Rido, and not actually an offspring of the parents of Yuuki? Veeeeery Interesting.

Kaien Cross is definitely a wild card here. My guess is that he knows a lot more about the Kuran family than anyone in the Hunters society. He may even know what kind of nefarious little agreement that the Society has with the Council.

--Looks like the head council lady has aligned herself with Rido's faction, and I'm wondering how much the other Hunters know about that, or if she is acting on her own and just issuing orders to the other. She the one in power who gives the orders, ...and as they say --"power corrupts".

[LynFay]

Originally Posted by Individual11

Are we sure the guy locked up right now is Zero? ---or could it be his twin brother? Nah - it's probably Zero...

I thought that Chapter 38 was interesting because it illustrated how indestructible purebloods really are. Kaname is actually the Kuran "ancestor" who was awakened by Rido, and not actually an offspring of the parents of Yuuki? Veeeeery Interesting.

Kaien Cross is definitely a wild card here. My guess is that he knows a lot more about the Kuran family than anyone in the Hunters society. He may even know what kind of nefarious little agreement that the Society has with the Council.

--Looks like the head council lady has aligned herself with Rido's faction, and I'm wondering how much the other Hunters know about that, or if she is acting on her own and just issuing orders to the other. She the one in power who gives the orders, ...and as they say --"power corrupts".

Wow. that's serious insight. but i totally agree with you! if Kaien Cross does know more than most (i think he does) then he's going to be on the vampires side because he said, and i quote, "that's why i hate vampire hunters" in reference to Zero's teacher. Also, he seems to have known Kaname's mother quite well, and the newly vamped Yuki, who's still his adopted daughter, has to have some kind on influence on his decisions.

i think that we need more information on the Kaname "ancestor" thing. so, does that mean he founded the whole of the pure-blooded Kuran line? Does it mean he's Kuran himself? or does he just mean he's one of Kuran's ancestors, like the one with the most power and influence.

and yes, the dude in jail is definatley Zero.

hey, has anyone given thought aas to what happened to the Kuran's fisrt born. they say to Rido, "You stole our First born" but they didn't say he died...

[jalil]

there is a saying that goes "keep your friends close, and your enemies closer." the council and the hunter's society seem to have a mutual agreement on some matter. It's called politics. they seek to control one another so that one cannot rise more than the other. (that sentence doesn't make sense.)

[seeliespright]

Originally Posted by LynFay

i think that we need more information on the Kaname "ancestor" thing. so, does that mean he founded the whole of the pure-blooded Kuran line? Does it mean he's Kuran himself? or does he just mean he's one of Kuran's ancestors, like the one with the most power and influence.

I definitely think Cross is on the side of the vampires. He had some deep attachment with Juuri and obviously with the family since he took Yuuki in and raised her as a daughter.

I don't think Kaname founded the line, but he was certainly early in it. Kuran is their last line so presumably that would not be the first name of the founder... although then you get back to "where did their name come from originally?" The meanings of all of the characters' names have been explained in the past (at the end of the published volumes), but I can't remember what Kuran means. One of the two means "door" or "hinge", but I think that's Kaname. I seem to recall Kuran means "6 orchids" or something related. I can't look it up right now though because the volumes are at home, in another country.

As for the Kurans' firstborn: They had a boy whose soul was taken by Rido (and presumably destroyed) then Rido put Kaname's soul (the ancestor) into the son's body. So, the son did die, but his body lives on since it's occupied by Kaname.